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In message , at 09:09:09 on Tue, 10 Mar
2015, d remarked:
When I worked in London for a decade until 2011 I noted that most of the
younger people I worked with came from every part of the UK except London,
while born and bred Londoners like me had long ago departed for places like
Crawley, Chelmsford and Cambridge.

Chelmsford is quite nice, Cambridge gorgeous. But Crawley? You'd have to be
pretty desperate to see that place as an improvement on London :)

For Chelmsford and Crawley the main attraction is cheaper houses and the
frequent rail service to London.
--
Roland Perry

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On Mon, Mar 09, 2015 at 02:52:35PM +0000, d wrote:

Its funny isn't it how some people are so keen on uncontrolled immigration yet
when the inveitable consequences occur - eg **** all housing available in
london at a reasonable rent - its suddenly someone elses fault.

You're right, it is someone else's fault.

It's Clement Attlee's fault. Stupid Town and Country Planning Act 1947
and its successors. Without that, land owners would be able to far more
easily build houses that people want to live in in places that people
want to live.

pays so little due to immigrants
pushing the wages down (and anyone who claims they haven't doesn't live in
the real world I'm afraid).

The data disagrees.

--
David Cantrell | semi-evolved ape-thing

Vegetarian: n: a person who, due to malnutrition caused by
poor lifestyle choices, is eight times more likely to
catch TB than a normal person

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On Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:26:44 +0000
David Cantrell wrote:
On Mon, Mar 09, 2015 at 02:52:35PM +0000, d wrote:

Its funny isn't it how some people are so keen on uncontrolled immigration
yet
when the inveitable consequences occur - eg **** all housing available in
london at a reasonable rent - its suddenly someone elses fault.

You're right, it is someone else's fault.

It's Clement Attlee's fault. Stupid Town and Country Planning Act 1947
and its successors. Without that, land owners would be able to far more
easily build houses that people want to live in in places that people
want to live.

Oh , you mean that silly green belt thing? Yes, god forbid we should have
some greenery around london and stop it ending up a sprawling mess like
LA or Tokyo. After all, those sorts of places are Utopia, right?

pushing the wages down (and anyone who claims they haven't doesn't live in
the real world I'm afraid).

The data disagrees.

More statistics plucked out of someones arse for a Guardian story? You can
keep them. Real world wages have been going down for a number of trades
and thats not just heresay, its based on first hand knowledge of people who
work in them.

--
Spud

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In message , at 16:39:05 on Tue, 10 Mar
2015, d remarked:
Real world wages have been going down for a number of trades
and thats not just heresay

I gather there's not much work for Concorde pilots at the moment.
--
Roland Perry

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In article , (Roland
Perry) wrote:

In message , at 09:09:09 on Tue, 10
Mar 2015, d remarked:
When I worked in London for a decade until 2011 I noted that most of the
younger people I worked with came from every part of the UK except
London, while born and bred Londoners like me had long ago departed for
places like Crawley, Chelmsford and Cambridge.

Chelmsford is quite nice, Cambridge gorgeous. But Crawley? You'd have to
be pretty desperate to see that place as an improvement on London :)

For Chelmsford and Crawley the main attraction is cheaper houses and
the frequent rail service to London.

Since all three places were the homes of colleagues commuting to where I
worked in Westminster, that's the main point.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

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On Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:50:44 -0500
wrote:
In article , (Roland
Perry) wrote:

In message , at 09:09:09 on Tue, 10
Mar 2015, d remarked:
When I worked in London for a decade until 2011 I noted that most of the
younger people I worked with came from every part of the UK except
London, while born and bred Londoners like me had long ago departed for
places like Crawley, Chelmsford and Cambridge.

Chelmsford is quite nice, Cambridge gorgeous. But Crawley? You'd have to
be pretty desperate to see that place as an improvement on London :)

For Chelmsford and Crawley the main attraction is cheaper houses and
the frequent rail service to London.

Since all three places were the homes of colleagues commuting to where I
worked in Westminster, that's the main point.

The main problem with these commuter towns is that most people don't live
within walking distance of the one main station and so its not just a rail
trip - they have a car, bus or bike trip first. Which all adds to commuting
time and expense.

--
Spud

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On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 04:39:05PM +0000, d wrote:
On Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:26:44 +0000 David Cantrell wrote:
On Mon, Mar 09, 2015 at 02:52:35PM +0000, d wrote:
pushing the wages down (and anyone who claims they haven't doesn't live in
the real world I'm afraid).
The data disagrees.
More statistics plucked out of someones arse for a Guardian story?

No.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...-10075047.html

You can keep them. Real world wages have been going down for a number
of trades

That could well be true. Doesn't mean that it's related to immigration.

and thats not just heresay, its based on first hand
knowledge of people who work in them.

That's a beautiful sampling method you've chosen. It's pretty much
the best way of getting data that doesn't match the reality of the whole
population.

--
David Cantrell | London Perl Mongers Deputy Chief Heretic

NANOG makes me want to unplug everything and hide under the bed
-- brian d foy

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On Wed, 11 Mar 2015 12:55:29 +0000
David Cantrell wrote:
On Tue, Mar 10, 2015 at 04:39:05PM +0000, d wrote:
On Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:26:44 +0000 David Cantrell
wrote:
On Mon, Mar 09, 2015 at 02:52:35PM +0000, d
wrote:
pushing the wages down (and anyone who claims they haven't doesn't live in
the real world I'm afraid).
The data disagrees.
More statistics plucked out of someones arse for a Guardian story?

No.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk...ain-has-not-in
reased-unemployment-or-reduced-wages-study-finds-10075047.html

The Independent - the Guardians slightly stupid little brother in co-operation
with the London Socialist Enclave. Yeah, that'll be unbiased.

http://www.migrationwatchuk.org/pressArticle/83

"collection of essays published recently by the IPPR underlined the role of
Gordon Brown’s Treasury in this affair. A high level of immigration made
economic growth look better and helped keep wages and, therefore, inflation
down."

You can keep them. Real world wages have been going down for a number
of trades

That could well be true. Doesn't mean that it's related to immigration.

Well, climate change might not be related to man made CO2. But lets be honest,
it probably is. Ditto above.


and thats not just heresay, its based on first hand
knowledge of people who work in them.

That's a beautiful sampling method you've chosen. It's pretty much
the best way of getting data that doesn't match the reality of the whole
population.

But I'm sure your social circle is a much more accurate reflection of
society, right?

--
Spud

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On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 09:40:45AM +0000, d wrote:
On Tue, 10 Mar 2015 12:50:44 -0500
wrote:
In article , (Roland
Perry) wrote:
For Chelmsford and Crawley the main attraction is cheaper houses and
the frequent rail service to London.
Since all three places were the homes of colleagues commuting to where I
worked in Westminster, that's the main point.
The main problem with these commuter towns is that most people don't live
within walking distance of the one main station and so its not just a rail
trip

I don't think you're right there. Most of Chelmsford is within a thirty
minute walk of the station. From a quick look at a map, Crawley is
similar - and it has three stations

--
David Cantrell | Godless Liberal Elitist

Anyone who cannot cope with mathematics is not fully human.
At best he is a tolerable subhuman who has learned to wear
shoes, bathe and not make messes in the house.
-- Robert A Heinlein

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On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 02:36:47PM +0000, d wrote:
On Wed, 11 Mar 2015 12:55:29 +0000 David Cantrell wrote:
and thats not just heresay, its based on first hand
knowledge of people who work in them.
That's a beautiful sampling method you've chosen. It's pretty much
the best way of getting data that doesn't match the reality of the whole
population.
But I'm sure your social circle is a much more accurate reflection of
society, right?

It wouldn't be, which is why I didn't use it.

--
David Cantrell | Godless Liberal Elitist

THIS IS THE LANGUAGE POLICE
PUT DOWN YOUR THESAURUS
STEP AWAY FROM THE CLICHE