John Hearns wrote:
On Thu, 15 Apr 2004 20:24:04 +0000, Richard J. wrote:


Complete rubbish. If a wheelchair user needs to access any level
other than ground level, a lift is required. In the event of
fire, the lifts are not available, and people have to use the
stairs. In those circumstances, wheelchair users have to be
carried to ground level. The same applies to tube trains.

Wrong. The lifts on the JLE are clearly marked as firefighting
lifts.
I don't work for the fire brigade or the underground, but I'd
imagine this means they are available during a fire...

Also, if I'm not wrong, there are disabled refuge areas at the
emergency exits, similar to the ones in many cinemas and public
buildings.

Maybe, but I was comparing the situation in a typical office building,
say, where lifts are not available in a fire, with the situation in a
tube *train* (not station) where there is neither refuge nor fireproof
lift.
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 22:53:16 +0000, Richard J. wrote:



Maybe, but I was comparing the situation in a typical office building,
say, where lifts are not available in a fire, with the situation in a
tube *train* (not station) where there is neither refuge nor fireproof
lift.

The lift at Bermondsey is a firefighting lift.

And I'm asking you in return what is the LU/Fire Brigade policy for
dealing with obese and elderly passengers in the event of an evacuation?

My guess - the fire brigade help them up the stairs.

On Sun, 18 Apr 2004 at 09:47:20, John Hearns wrote:

On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 22:53:16 +0000, Richard J. wrote:



Maybe, but I was comparing the situation in a typical office building,
say, where lifts are not available in a fire, with the situation in a
tube *train* (not station) where there is neither refuge nor fireproof
lift.

The lift at Bermondsey is a firefighting lift.

As may be - but it goes to the *station*, and Richard J is thinking of
the situation within a tube *train*. There are no lifts in a train, and
precious few ways of getting out of one in a tunnel in an emergency.
Except, of course, on those lines which are not technically "tube"
lines.
--
Annabel Smyth
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/index.html
Website updated 8 March 2004

I think there is something fundamentally missing from
this discussion.

Disabled people - and that includes blind people with guide dogs,
people with walking difficulties and people in wheelchairs are
able to travel on any London Underground or DLR train, on any line, at any
time.

Whether or not of course the wheelchair can get onto the platform/train
depends on the stations en route.

In article ,
John Hearns wrote:
On Sat, 17 Apr 2004 22:53:16 +0000, Richard J. wrote:



Maybe, but I was comparing the situation in a typical office
building, say, where lifts are not available in a fire, with the
situation in a tube *train* (not station) where there is neither
refuge nor fireproof lift.

The lift at Bermondsey is a firefighting lift.

And I'm asking you in return what is the LU/Fire Brigade policy for
dealing with obese and elderly passengers in the event of an
evacuation?

My guess - the fire brigade help them up the stairs.

The point of a fire lift is that there should be a safe lobby area
associated with it. The lift is designed to be safe to use in a fire.
People who cannot manage the stairs go to the lobby and wait. The fire
brigade is informed they are there so they can go and get them (using
the lift).

Design of the lift includes making the electrical system safe,
providing smoke extraction or (pressurisation) and putting sufficient
pump capacity in so it does not fill with water.

Disclaimer:
That is the idea in buildings, I cannot vouch for it being LUL policy.

John Haines