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Old September 8th 19, 01:36 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/transport-secretary-grant-shapps-on-why-he-bought-a-tesla-model-3-0tnhhks7j?shareToken=a70221daed84a5f553e362f97fc7a 5a7

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Old September 8th 19, 07:45 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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"Recliner" wrote in message
...


https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/transport-secretary-grant-shapps-on-why-he-bought-a-tesla-model-3-0tnhhks7j?shareToken=a70221daed84a5f553e362f97fc7a 5a7


so the reasons seem to be:

because he got government grant of 3,500 - for a near 50 grand car (after
options) is that really a deal maker?

So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your average
second hand petrol model achieves that

not very compelling, is it?

especially as he admits himself that there are not enough public charge
points - there's not a single one within parking distance of my house

tim



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Old September 8th 19, 08:22 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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tim... wrote:


"Recliner" wrote in message
...


https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/transport-secretary-grant-shapps-on-why-he-bought-a-tesla-model-3-0tnhhks7j?shareToken=a70221daed84a5f553e362f97fc7a 5a7


so the reasons seem to be:

because he got government grant of 3,500 - for a near 50 grand car (after
options) is that really a deal maker?


It seems to be the biggest factor with BEVs and PHEVs: withdraw the
subsidy, and sales plummet. That's been demonstrated in both the UK and
many other countries. And when you consider that, even with the subsidy,
most BEVs are also loss-making for the manufacturer, it's clear that the
gap between what most people are willing to pay and what it costs to make
them is still large (though shrinking).


So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your average
second hand petrol model achieves that


Perhaps not for long?


not very compelling, is it?


It presumably is for a virtue-signalling politician.


especially as he admits himself that there are not enough public charge
points - there's not a single one within parking distance of my house


Same here.
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Old September 8th 19, 08:32 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 08:45:36 on Sun, 8 Sep 2019,
tim... remarked:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/t...21daed84a5f553
e362f97fc7a5a7


so the reasons seem to be:

because he got government grant of 3,500 - for a near 50 grand car
(after options) is that really a deal maker?

So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your
average second hand petrol model achieves that

not very compelling, is it?


The various greenwash suspicions are interestingly at odds with a much
earlier decision not to buy Priuses(sp) as ministerial cars, because
their overall footprint wasn't regarded as sufficiently compelling.

especially as he admits himself that there are not enough public charge
points - there's not a single one within parking distance of my house


The nearest two Tesla chargers to my house are both 15 minutes drive,
and at hotel/B&B type locations. Are those truly "public"?

I'm surprised to see there's a "Pod point" [whatever that is] charger at
the Sainsbury's, because I've never noticed it. I'll go take a proper
look tomorrow.
--
Roland Perry
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Old September 8th 19, 08:49 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 08:22:19 on Sun, 8 Sep 2019,
Recliner remarked:

So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your average
second hand petrol model achieves that


Perhaps not for long?


Are they changing the standard, as well as the coverage area.

Currently approximates to petrol 2005+, diesels 2015+.
--
Roland Perry


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Old September 8th 19, 09:00 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 08:22:19 on Sun, 8 Sep 2019,
Recliner remarked:

So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your average
second hand petrol model achieves that


Perhaps not for long?


Are they changing the standard, as well as the coverage area.

Currently approximates to petrol 2005+, diesels 2015+.


They'll almost certainly tighten the rules at some point. It's like the
exemption from the congestion charge, for which the rules have got steadily
tighter.

I think there's also a desire to widen the coverage area (beyond the
Circulars), but not fr a while.

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Old September 8th 19, 10:05 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 09:00:18 on Sun, 8 Sep 2019,
Recliner remarked:
So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your average
second hand petrol model achieves that

Perhaps not for long?


Are they changing the standard, as well as the coverage area.

Currently approximates to petrol 2005+, diesels 2015+.


They'll almost certainly tighten the rules at some point. It's like the
exemption from the congestion charge, for which the rules have got steadily
tighter.


At which point the fleet of secondhand petrol cars will consist of
higher-standard vehicles, which might well not be leap-frogged in the
egregious way Euro5 diesels were.

I think there's also a desire to widen the coverage area (beyond the
Circulars), but not fr a while.


I had an idea they were already considering as far as the M25.
--
Roland Perry
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Old September 8th 19, 10:28 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 09:00:18 on Sun, 8 Sep 2019,
Recliner remarked:
So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your average
second hand petrol model achieves that

Perhaps not for long?

Are they changing the standard, as well as the coverage area.

Currently approximates to petrol 2005+, diesels 2015+.


They'll almost certainly tighten the rules at some point. It's like the
exemption from the congestion charge, for which the rules have got steadily
tighter.


At which point the fleet of secondhand petrol cars will consist of
higher-standard vehicles, which might well not be leap-frogged in the
egregious way Euro5 diesels were.


They won't necessarily be banned, but will have to pay some sort of
emissions tariff, as is happening now. It's probably only a matter of time
before only ZEVs get into central London without some sort of charge, and
the dirtiest vehicles will be banned altogether. But TfL will first have to
get its own house in order, using only zero-emissions buses in central
London.


I think there's also a desire to widen the coverage area (beyond the
Circulars), but not fr a while.


I had an idea they were already considering as far as the M25.


I don't think the GLA has any authority beyond the London boroughs.

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Old September 8th 19, 10:39 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default Electric Shapps

On Sun, 8 Sep 2019 01:36:43 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:



https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/transport-secretary-grant-shapps-on-why-he-bought-a-tesla-model-3-0tnhhks7j?shareToken=a70221daed84a5f553e362f97fc7a 5a7


Good job he got his Telsa before the subsidy's withdrawn, then.

https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/e...-out-bfq8b6ppp

And the minister pointing this out? Grant Shapps.

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Old September 8th 19, 10:58 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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On 08/09/2019 11:05, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 09:00:18 on Sun, 8 Sep 2019,
Recliner remarked:
So he can save on the ultra-low emission zone fee, - surely your
average
second hand petrol model achieves that

Perhaps not for long?

Are they changing the standard, as well as the coverage area.

Currently approximates to petrol 2005+, diesels 2015+.


They'll almost certainly tighten the rules at some point. It's like the
exemption from the congestion charge, for which the rules have got
steadily
tighter.


At which point the fleet of secondhand petrol cars will consist of
higher-standard vehicles, which might well not be leap-frogged in the
egregious way Euro5 diesels were.

I think there's also a desire to widen the coverage area (beyond the
Circulars), but not fr a while.


I had an idea they were already considering as far as the M25.


There's a certain amount of resistance to that from communities inside
the M25 that do not consider themselves part of London.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.



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