John Rowland wrote:

Only their long distance passengers. Their lack of interest in
serving local
London journeys is blatant and seemingly out of character.

I suspect that this treatment of local London passengers is not
entirely down to any malicious reasons - I would point to
infrastructure constraints as the primary reason, closely followed by
lack of ridership, proximity to higher-frequency transport and
unsuitable journey opportunities - does anyone living at Northolt Park,
Sudbury Hill, Sudbury & Harrow Road or Wembley Stadium want to go
anywhere that can be reached from Marylebone or the Ruislips?

TheOneKEA wrote:
John Rowland wrote:

Only their long distance passengers. Their lack of interest in

serving local

London journeys is blatant and seemingly out of character.


I suspect that this treatment of local London passengers is not
entirely down to any malicious reasons - I would point to
infrastructure constraints as the primary reason, closely followed by
lack of ridership, proximity to higher-frequency transport and
unsuitable journey opportunities - does anyone living at Northolt Park,
Sudbury Hill, Sudbury & Harrow Road or Wembley Stadium want to go
anywhere that can be reached from Marylebone or the Ruislips?


Forgive my ignorance - hard to keep up from 12,000 km away, but is the
"New North" line out from Old Oak Common to Northolt Jcn still used by
any passenger trains from Paddington? ISTR the line was singled in part
some years ago, but that there was still the occasional train from Padd
to (presumably) Birmingham

Marty
New Zealand

Marty wrote:

Forgive my ignorance - hard to keep up from 12,000 km away, but is
the "New North" line out from Old Oak Common to Northolt Jcn still
used by any passenger trains from Paddington? ISTR the line was
singled in part some years ago, but that there was still the
occasional train from Padd to (presumably) Birmingham

The Birmingham Direct line, between Old Oak West Junction and Northolt
Junction, is still used occassionally for freight workings,
parliamentary trains, ECS and diverted passenger trains. When the link
line from Neasden to Northolt is closed and Chiltern trains cannot
reach Marylebone, the Direct line is used to run Chiltern services to
Birmingham from Paddington.

The line is single between Northolt Junction and Greenford West
Junction, double thence to Park Royal West Junction and single to Old
Oak West Junction. Linespeeds are appalling along this stretch, with 40
being the average for a route that was once 90.

Rumours once placed this line at the center of the Crossrail route to
High Wycombe.

On 9 May 2005, TheOneKEA wrote:

John Rowland wrote:

Only their long distance passengers. Their lack of interest in serving
local London journeys is blatant and seemingly out of character.

I suspect that this treatment of local London passengers is not entirely
down to any malicious reasons

I'd probably agree - Hanlon's razor and all that. Perhaps the reason
they're not too bothered about the inner suburban services is that the
ridership is so low, Chiltern don't consider them a significant customer
base, and so they don't devote much energy or money to looking after them.
Of course, the other way of looking at it is that if they did take more
care over suburban services, they might become a more significant customer
group!

- I would point to infrastructure constraints as the primary reason,
closely followed by lack of ridership, proximity to higher-frequency
transport and unsuitable journey opportunities - does anyone living at
Northolt Park, Sudbury Hill, Sudbury & Harrow Road or Wembley Stadium
want to go anywhere that can be reached from Marylebone or the Ruislips?

That is the major problem with Chiltern. Roll on Crossrail 4!

tom

--
.... the gripping first chapter, which literally grips you because it's printed on a large clamp.

On 9 May 2005 02:28:14 -0700, "TheOneKEA" wrote:

John Rowland wrote:

Only their long distance passengers. Their lack of interest in
serving local
London journeys is blatant and seemingly out of character.

I suspect that this treatment of local London passengers is not
entirely down to any malicious reasons - I would point to
infrastructure constraints as the primary reason, closely followed by
lack of ridership, proximity to higher-frequency transport and
unsuitable journey opportunities - does anyone living at Northolt Park,
Sudbury Hill, Sudbury & Harrow Road or Wembley Stadium want to go
anywhere that can be reached from Marylebone or the Ruislips?

Well, you can reach the whole of central London from Marylebone...

The Birmingham Direct line, between Old Oak West Junction and Northolt
Junction, is still used occassionally for freight workings,
parliamentary trains, ECS and diverted passenger trains. When the link
line from Neasden to Northolt is closed and Chiltern trains cannot
reach Marylebone, the Direct line is used to run Chiltern services to
Birmingham from Paddington.

The line is single between Northolt Junction and Greenford West
Junction, double thence to Park Royal West Junction and single to Old
Oak West Junction. Linespeeds are appalling along this stretch, with 40
being the average for a route that was once 90.

When and why was it singled? I travelled on the West Ruislip branch of
the Central line sometime around 1990, and vaguely seem to remember
the Direct line being all double track then (though I might be wrong).
What reason could there have been since then to go out and single it?

asdf wrote:
When and why was it singled? I travelled on the West Ruislip branch
of
the Central line sometime around 1990, and vaguely seem to remember
the Direct line being all double track then (though I might be
wrong).
What reason could there have been since then to go out and single it?



Don't know when, but I do know that the singling involved leaving the
other track in situ. The "new" single line was sometimes the up line,
and sometimes the down (hence (some of) the speed restrictions), and
the remainder stayed put. 'Course, it may have been removed now, but
it may have *looked* like double track when you saw it, but was
actually single.

Hope that makes sense!

PhilD

--

TheOneKEA wrote:
John Rowland wrote:

Only their long distance passengers. Their lack of interest in

serving local

London journeys is blatant and seemingly out of character.


I suspect that this treatment of local London passengers is not
entirely down to any malicious reasons - I would point to
infrastructure constraints as the primary reason, closely followed by
lack of ridership, proximity to higher-frequency transport and
unsuitable journey opportunities - does anyone living at Northolt Park,
Sudbury Hill, Sudbury & Harrow Road or Wembley Stadium want to go
anywhere that can be reached from Marylebone or the Ruislips?

I do on Thursday (well actually it is King's Cross I need to get to but
if there were trains at the right time then via Marylebone would be
quicker). OK it is only occasionally more convenient for me (about 4-5
journeys a year) but I suspect there are some commuters who would find
it quicker than the Picc most days.

--
To contact me take a davidhowdon and add a @yahoo.co.uk to the end.

On 9 May 2005, PhilD wrote:

asdf wrote:

When and why was it singled? I travelled on the West Ruislip branch of
the Central line sometime around 1990, and vaguely seem to remember
the Direct line being all double track then (though I might be wrong).
What reason could there have been since then to go out and single it?

Don't know when, but I do know that the singling involved leaving the
other track in situ.

Sounds like a rather Zen form of singling! What was the point?

tom

--
you can't feel your stomack with glory -- Czako

On 9 May 2005 07:23:20 -0700, "PhilD" wrote:


asdf wrote:
When and why was it singled? I travelled on the West Ruislip branch
of
the Central line sometime around 1990, and vaguely seem to remember
the Direct line being all double track then (though I might be
wrong).
What reason could there have been since then to go out and single it?

Don't know when, but I do know that the singling involved leaving the
other track in situ. The "new" single line was sometimes the up line,
and sometimes the down (hence (some of) the speed restrictions), and
the remainder stayed put. 'Course, it may have been removed now, but
it may have *looked* like double track when you saw it, but was
actually single.

Ah, so it could have happened before then.

I seem to remember that at the time, there was no noticable difference
between the two tracks - both looked a bit rusty, but viable. Nowadays
(having seen part of the line recently), one of the two tracks is
obviously disused, being overgrown and very rusty.