In article . com,
() wrote:

As time has moved on since this thread started, once again can I ask
how many Routemasters remain on the 13? Are any of the new buses in
service yet? If so, how many?

All the 13s I saw on Wednesday were RMs. I was crossing the route at
Trafalgar Square between Charing Cross Road and Whitehall so only saw
two of them, mind.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

At least three 'boxes' on the 13 today. Truly ugly in appearance with
the same angular front roof dome as used on the 9 and an utter asthetic
disaster.

Awful provincial-style large route number and destination only, no
front via points, meaning London's buses have finally descended to the
level of the rest of the UK.

Well done TfL, who presumably set the standards (sic) of such things?

On 17 Oct 2005 08:08:17 -0700, wrote:


At least three 'boxes' on the 13 today. Truly ugly in appearance with
the same angular front roof dome as used on the 9 and an utter asthetic
disaster.

Scania Omnidekkas with East Lancs bodywork - same bodybuilder as the
Volvos on route 9.

Awful provincial-style large route number and destination only, no
front via points, meaning London's buses have finally descended to the
level of the rest of the UK.

Well done TfL, who presumably set the standards (sic) of such things?

Yes. I cannot fathom the change to the traditional style of LT blind. As
tenders are re-awarded all blinds will deteriorate to this lowest common
denominator mess. If this is deemed necessary for the DDA then it truly
is an awful piece of legislation in terms of what is being sacrificed in
order to achieve "compliance".
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Truly a case of the baby being thrown out with the bathwater.

Is the argument that to be D.D.A.-compliant, all lettering must be of a
certain size (thus banning via-point sized lettering altogether)
because the partially-sighted can only see above a certain size?

If that is so, then blinds ought to be abolished altogether, since the
totally blind won't be able to see them at all, and surely this is
discriminating against them!

And what about discriminating against those that cannot read at all?
Surely the only legal alternative is to have a sound system installed
near the front doors of all buses, blaring out the number, destination
and via points for the benefit of the partially-sighted, blind and
illiterate.

Oh, sorry, forgot - that would be discriminating against the
hard-of-hearing, deaf and imbeciles who cannot understand human speech
at all.

The only guaranteed way to discriminate against nobody is to abolish
the buses altogether.

You think I am joking: already several country mobile bank and library
services have been abolished because they were not D.D.A.-compliant.
So, those people relying on those vital services were simply left
without a service.

Marc.

Lothian Buses sees no problem in retaining intermediate point front
blinds on new deliveries and claims these are quite compliant with the
DDA Act.

In fact their standards are higher than London in that such 'via'
blinds are changed if the bus is not travelling the full distance (the
famous magenta "part route" display).

They also have yellow displays for peak hour express routes (if only
here!)and even rear 'ultimates' on new d/d deliveries, and all set
automatically from the cab!

On Mon, 17 Oct 2005 17:21:43 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:

Yes. I cannot fathom the change to the traditional style of LT blind. As
tenders are re-awarded all blinds will deteriorate to this lowest common
denominator mess. If this is deemed necessary for the DDA then it truly
is an awful piece of legislation in terms of what is being sacrificed in
order to achieve "compliance".

I doubt it is. Many provincial buses are now being introduced with
2-line scrolling amber LED displays, which IMO match the best roller
blind for legibility and flexibility, and can (when combined with GPS
technology and potentially interior displays) update on the move.

If only TfL would get over their insistence on outmoded paper blinds,
there is far better kit out there, and it probably isn't all that much
more expensive than printing blinds every time a route changes.

Neil

--
Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK
When replying please use neil at the above domain
'wensleydale' is a spam trap and is not read.

wrote:

You think I am joking

No, I think you're being silly.
--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p9683661.html
(Class 108 54194 at Kettering - last day of the Corby service, 1990)

wrote in message
ups.com...

The only guaranteed way to discriminate against
nobody is to abolish the buses altogether.

You think I am joking: already several country mobile
bank and library services have been abolished because
they were not D.D.A.-compliant. So, those people relying
on those vital services were simply left without a service.

There has also been at least one example in England of a proposed station
where the benefit:cost ratio was favourable if a non-wheelchair accessible
station was built, but was unfavourable if a wheelchair accessible station
was built, so no station will ever be built.

And in the US (Washington I think) there is a station which was closed
specifically because it was too expensive to make wheelchair accessible.

--
John Rowland - Spamtrapped
Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html
A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood.
That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line -
It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes

Bowroad points to Edinburgh and is quite correct to do so.
It is quite astonishing to see just how far ahead Lothian is in quality
terms even with its older vehicles.
The electronic destination systems,whether Dot Matrix or LED simply cant
hold a candle to the Printed Stock,which when combined with Power adjustment
makes the clearest display available....

Okay, Chris Tolley, I am being silly. Mea culpa to use a silly example
by taking an argument to its ultimate conclusion to illustrate a point.


Presumably you are in favour of the removal of "via points" on blinds,
so that those of us without encyclopaedic knowledge of London bus
routes will never try a new route because we won't know any of its
intermediate points.

Anyway, Chris Tolley, your railway pictures are very nice.

Marc.