Colin wrote:
"Richard J." wrote in message
o.uk...
wrote:


http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/downloads/...06-leaflet.pdf

The Family Travelcard, Tube Carnet, Single zone Travelcard seasons
and some New Deal tickets are being withdrawn. But a less obvious
disappearance is Oyster Prepay. It's now referred to as 'pay as
you
go'!

That's crazy! It's not pay as you go, it's pay *before* you go.
Pre-Pay was a good name which accurately described the concept of
paying in advance for a number of journeys, as distinct from paying
for each journey in cash, which *is* pay-as-you-go. I suppose
they're trying to hide the fact that they will get lots of money up
front, but in changing the name they have just made the whole
Oyster concept more difficult to understand. I feel an e-mail to
TfL coming on.

Oh come on Richard. 'Pay As You Go' is common parlance now thanks
to the popular Mobile Phone payment mechanism.

Oyster Pre-Pay is exactly the same concept as mobile phone PAYG. It
makes absolute sense for TfL to describe it using a term that the
general public (excepting yourself perhaps) are totally comfortable
with.

Well, I must admit that the inconvenience of PAYG mobile phones is not
something that I have to put up with, having an Orange "Virgin EQ"
contract with zero rental and my (relatively few) call charges paid
monthly by direct debit. Sadly, Orange no longer offer this.

But I still feel that PAYG is a daft term for Oyster, since TfL want it
to be a replacement for cash fares which really are PAYG and don't have
a £3 initial charge.
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

Laurence Payne typed

If you stick to busses, you are capped at the price of a one-day bus
pass. If you use tube as well, you are capped at the price of a
one-day travelcard. Or slightly less - isn't there a small discount?

50p from 2/1/2006.

You need to buy a paper TC if you need to use National Rail within th
travelcard zone. NR are dragging their heels at implementing oyster
pre-pay.

--
Helen D. Vecht:
Edgware.

wrote in message
oups.com...
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/downloads/...06-leaflet.pdf

The Family Travelcard, Tube Carnet, Single zone Travelcard seasons and
some New Deal tickets are being withdrawn. But a less obvious
disappearance is Oyster Prepay. It's now referred to as 'pay as you
go'!

Dominic


Does anyone know the URL for the fares north of Moor Park for 2006 ?

On Wed, 26 Oct 2005 20:51:25 +0100, "EK"
wrote:

At what point would it be better to buy a 1 day travelcard instead of
relying on the capping ?

If you:

- wish to travel on National Rail (except certain routes where pre-pay
is valid)
- are the holder of a Railcard or Gold Card, or are travelling with
someone who is, if you can buy a discounted Travelcard, and if it
would cost less than the pre-pay cap would be
- want the daily charge to cover journeys starting between 0000 and
0429 the following day (as opposed to 0430 and 0429 the following
day)
- are not travelling via Zone 1, but are making at least 1 Tube
journey that would be charged as if you did
- often forget to touch in
- have an unregistered Oyster card and often forget to touch out

On 26 Oct 2005 09:06:49 -0700, wrote:

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/downloads/...06-leaflet.pdf

The Family Travelcard, Tube Carnet, Single zone Travelcard seasons and
some New Deal tickets are being withdrawn. But a less obvious
disappearance is Oyster Prepay. It's now referred to as 'pay as you
go'!

The fares leaflet also includes something completely new that's
interesting and doesn't seem to have been publicised. Currently,
through tickets are available between Tube/DLR and NR, but they are
charged at the same price as buying a separate ticket for each leg.
However, the PDF introduces a new concept of "Tube/DLR – Train fares":

"Tube/DLR – Train fares cover through journeys
between the Tube/DLR and National Rail and
are the maximum that you will pay for a single
journey in the London zonal area."

The tickets are zonal singles (with a return costing twice the single
fare). Although they are more expensive than Tube singles (and
*considerably* more expensive than pre-pay fares), for the first time,
there are singles available which are "blind" as to whether the
journey covers Tube/DLR, NR, or both. Is this the first step towards
the harmonisation of rail fares across modes in London, and the
ubiquitous validity of pre-pay?

The fares leaflet also includes something completely new that's
interesting and doesn't seem to have been publicised. Currently,
through tickets are available between Tube/DLR and NR, but they are
charged at the same price as buying a separate ticket for each leg.
However, the PDF introduces a new concept of "Tube/DLR - Train fares":

"Tube/DLR - Train fares cover through journeys
between the Tube/DLR and National Rail and
are the maximum that you will pay for a single
journey in the London zonal area."

The tickets are zonal singles (with a return costing twice the single
fare). Although they are more expensive than Tube singles (and
*considerably* more expensive than pre-pay fares), for the first time,
there are singles available which are "blind" as to whether the
journey covers Tube/DLR, NR, or both. Is this the first step towards
the harmonisation of rail fares across modes in London, and the
ubiquitous validity of pre-pay?

There is a note saying: "and are the *maximum* that you will pay for a
single journey in the London zonal area"

What does this mean? Are they priced at the highest possible rail fare
they could find in order to make them valid to any rail destination in the
respective zones?

The implication is for some routes these will represent bad value if the
rail companies fare (+ the tube journey) is much less than the combined
ticket.

Is there any mechanism to protect the customer from buying the more
expensive ticket?

Richard J. wrote:
But I still feel that PAYG is a daft term for Oyster, since TfL want it
to be a replacement for cash fares which really are PAYG and don't have
a £3 initial charge.

Depends how much you value your time.

Anyone more senior than a kitchen cleaner will spend £3 of their time a week
queuing to buy cash singles.

Raoul.

But I still feel that PAYG is a daft term for Oyster, since TfL want it
to be a replacement for cash fares which really are PAYG and don't have
a £3 initial charge.

Perhaps cash fares will be rebranded as "Pay through the nose" from January.

The £3 deposit can be recouped from two journeys from next year so its hardly
a moot point.

Cash - 2 x Zone 2 (£3) singles = £6

Oyster - 2 x Zone 2 (£1) prepay = £2 (+ £3 deposit) = £5

Not only recouped but a pound saved.

On Thu, 27 Oct 2005 07:03:31 +0100, "TKD" wrote:

There is a note saying: "and are the *maximum* that you will pay for a
single journey in the London zonal area"

What does this mean? Are they priced at the highest possible rail fare
they could find in order to make them valid to any rail destination in the
respective zones?

*looks for a counterexample*

Harrow & Wealdstone to East Croydon (on the direct service): Standard
Day Single £6.00; Cheap Day Single £3.60. Next year the Tube/DLR -
Train fare will be £3.40.

I would take "and are the maximum that you will pay..." to mean that
the (NR) ticket offices at H&W or EC would sell you this ticket
instead of the NR singles, as it's cheaper, even though the journey
doesn't include a Tube/DLR leg.

The implication is for some routes these will represent bad value if the
rail companies fare (+ the tube journey) is much less than the combined
ticket.

Perhaps the ticket office would sell an "old style" combined ticket in
this case.

said:

One group which, as far as I can see, is particularly hit by the new
structure is that of pensioners who can use their Freedom Pass after 9
a.m. but need to pay the high cash rates when traveling to earlier
hospital and other medical appointments.

Cash? There's nothing to stop a pensioner from also having a prepay
Oyster for the morning peak.