Space for trams - I hope

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle2872752.ece

quote
From The Times
November 15, 2007
Cars out as London mayor clears way for Paris-style plage and cycle
boulevards
Ben Webster, Transport Correspondent
Visitors to London may not find the streets paved with gold but they
could certainly find that a lot more streets have been paved, under
proposals for the tourist heart of the capital.
Cars will be banned from some of London's busiest streets as part of a
bold plan to create continental-style boulevards devoted to
pedestrians and cyclists.
Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris Plage,
the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each August, on the
four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.
He is also considering a ban on through traffic on a series of roads
connecting London's parks and main shopping areas, including Portland
Place, which runs between Regent's Park and Oxford Street.
Speaking at Mayor's Question Time at the London Assembly yesterday, Mr
Livingstone said that he wanted to create attractive, tree-lined
walkways in the style of Las Ramblas in Barcelona. Traffic would be
diverted on to alternative routes, but shops and restaurants would
still be able to receive deliveries outside peak hours.
The first scheme will be the £18 million part-pedestrianisation of
Parliament Square, which will involve removing traffic from the south
side closest to Westminster Abbey from 2009. Mr Livingstone believes
that the success of the Trafalgar Square scheme, where the road beside
the National Gallery has been pedestrianised, will help to overcome
objections by motoring groups and retailers.
The RAC Foundation said that Mr Livingstone's plan would force traffic
on to less suitable routes and add to congestion, which is already
almost back to the level before congestion charging began in 2003.
Edmund King, the foundation's director, said: "Mr Livingstone appears
to be choosing streets which are absolutely essential for through
traffic. Closing Victoria Embankment, even if only in August, would
cause complete chaos as traffic diverts on to less appropriate,
narrower streets.
"The mayor does not seem to realise that Paris virtually shuts down
each August but London is a global city that is very busy throughout
the year. Banning traffic from some streets might sound
environmentally friendly but it could push up emissions by sending
vehicles on longer, slower routes."
Mr Livingstone has been impressed by several ideas for tackling
traffic introduced by Bertrand Delanoë, the Socialist Mayor of Paris.
He is planning to copy the city's bicycle hire scheme and also
believes that the Paris Plage concept would be an even greater success
in London.
Each August since 2001, the Right Bank highway in Paris has been
closed to traffic for the two miles between the Pont Neuf and Pont de
Sully and covered by 2,000 tonnes of sand. The "beach" is dotted with
palm trees and cafés and lined by a boardwalk. It attracts more than
four million visitors a year, and some have been so eager to strip off
that a EURO 38 (£27) penalty was introduced last year for anyone going
nude, topless or in a thong.
Mr Livingstone's plan is partly in response to demands by the Green
Party, whose support he needs to win the London Assembly's approval
for his budget. Jenny Jones, a Green assembly member, said: "Making it
more enjoyable for people to go by foot will help to cut congestion
and relieve pressure on some of London's busiest bus and Tube
routes."
unquote

Mwmbwls wrote:

Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris Plage,
the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each August, on the
four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

Paris Plage is captured here...
http://maps.live.com/default.aspx?v=...6177&encType=1

Since London's South Bank is already pedestrianised, I can't see the point
of pedestrianising the north as well.

On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, John Rowland wrote:

Mwmbwls wrote:

Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris Plage,
the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each August, on the
four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

Since London's South Bank is already pedestrianised, I can't see the
point of pedestrianising the north as well.

Since London's South Bank is already pedestrianised and rather nice, i can
well see the point of pedestrianising the north as well.

tom

--
The sun just came out, I can't believe it

Tom Anderson wrote:
On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, John Rowland wrote:

Mwmbwls wrote:

Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris
Plage, the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each
August, on the four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

Since London's South Bank is already pedestrianised, I can't see the
point of pedestrianising the north as well.

Since London's South Bank is already pedestrianised and rather nice,
i can well see the point of pedestrianising the north as well.

I've never heard the South Bank called "nice" before... but I haven't used
it in a while. Is it full up then?

On Nov 15, 1:20 pm, "John Rowland"
wrote:
Tom Anderson wrote:
On Thu, 15 Nov 2007, John Rowland wrote:

Mwmbwls wrote:

Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris
Plage, the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each
August, on the four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

Since London's South Bank is already pedestrianised, I can't see the
point of pedestrianising the north as well.

Since London's South Bank is already pedestrianised and rather nice,
i can well see the point of pedestrianising the north as well.

I've never heard the South Bank called "nice" before... but I haven't used
it in a while. Is it full up then?


It's been quite a decent place to go for a while. There's always stuff
going on between Tower Bridge and County Hall, particularly in summer.
And the Royal Festival Hall redevelopment has done wonders for one of
the area's most unsightly buildings.

Jonn

wrote:

Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris
Plage, the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each
August, on the four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

It's been quite a decent place to go for a while. There's always stuff
going on between Tower Bridge and County Hall, particularly in summer.
And the Royal Festival Hall redevelopment has done wonders for one of
the area's most unsightly buildings.

Okay, but is it full up? Are there so many people sunbathing there that the
North Bank needs to be pedestrianised too?

On Nov 15, 9:31 am, Mwmbwls wrote:
Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris Plage,
the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each August, on the
four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

Can't see how that will work. I used to work right next to that road
and just by the sheer amount of traffic on it it must take a large
proportion of the east-west through traffic, a lot of it trucks and
coaches. If they close it the west end will probably sieze up. Theres
probably a case for narrowing it though , a dual carraigeway IMO is
overkill.

"The mayor does not seem to realise that Paris virtually shuts down

I would suggest thats a bit of myth. A lot of the french go on holiday
in august but saying the whole of paris shuts down is nonsense. I've
been there in august and the traffic in the centre was just as bad as
at any other time of year.

B2003

John Rowland wrote:
wrote:

Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris
Plage, the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each
August, on the four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

It's been quite a decent place to go for a while. There's always stuff
going on between Tower Bridge and County Hall, particularly in summer.
And the Royal Festival Hall redevelopment has done wonders for one of
the area's most unsightly buildings.

Okay, but is it full up? Are there so many people sunbathing there that the
North Bank needs to be pedestrianised too?

What does that mean John? Transport schemes aren't only based upon
when something's "full up". Improving the quality of the local
environment is also a laudable aim. I grant you that the needs of
other road users must also be considered, but having filled other
pedestrian locations isn't the prerequisite for opening a new one.

Boltar wrote:
On Nov 15, 9:31 am, Mwmbwls wrote:
Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris Plage,
the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each August, on
the four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

Can't see how that will work. I used to work right next to that road
and just by the sheer amount of traffic on it it must take a large
proportion of the east-west through traffic, a lot of it trucks and
coaches. If they close it the west end will probably sieze up. Theres
probably a case for narrowing it though , a dual carraigeway IMO is
overkill.

"The mayor does not seem to realise that Paris virtually shuts down

I would suggest thats a bit of myth. A lot of the french go on holiday
in august but saying the whole of paris shuts down is nonsense. I've
been there in august and the traffic in the centre was just as bad as
at any other time of year.

The fact that the most important road in Paris was shut but the traffic was
no worse than the rest of the year seems to prove that Paris virtually does
shut down in August!

On 15 Nov, 20:33, Tom Page wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
wrote:

Ken Livingstone, the Mayor of London, plans to replicate Paris
Plage, the beach created on a highway alongside the Seine each
August, on the four-lane Victoria Embankment beside the Thames.

It's been quite a decent place to go for a while. There's always stuff
going on between Tower Bridge and County Hall, particularly in summer.
And the Royal Festival Hall redevelopment has done wonders for one of
the area's most unsightly buildings.

Okay, but is it full up? Are there so many people sunbathing there that the
North Bank needs to be pedestrianised too?

What does that mean John? Transport schemes aren't only based upon
when something's "full up". Improving the quality of the local
environment is also a laudable aim. I grant you that the needs of
other road users must also be considered, but having filled other
pedestrian locations isn't the prerequisite for opening a new one.

Its pretty full as well. The northbank is important but road capacity
could be reduced as its a really fast road (relatively) and
comparitively underused. St Martins Lane would get my vote to be
pedestrianised as well as thats mainly a black cab rat run these days.