Tom Anderson wrote:

A tracked, armoured bus is being trialled in Peckham.

This is a joke, isn't it?

On Mon, 19 May 2008, James Farrar wrote:

On Sun, 18 May 2008 21:37:15 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote:

Bendification was only ever planned for the busiest routes, as it's
fairly expensive and requires good, wide roads.

Like some of the ones they use in Central London!

They *require* good, wide roads. They don't always get them!

tom

--
If you had a chance to do any experiment you pleased, unconstrained by
any considerations of humanity or decency, what would you choose?

On Mon, 19 May 2008, John Rowland wrote:

Tom Anderson wrote:

A tracked, armoured bus is being trialled in Peckham.

This is a joke, isn't it?

Sadly, yes.

There is that amphibious 'duck bus' that does sightseeing trips, though.
We should get some of those in the TfL fleet.

tom

--
If you had a chance to do any experiment you pleased, unconstrained by
any considerations of humanity or decency, what would you choose?

On Sun, 18 May 2008 15:11:18 -0500, (Mark Brader) wrote:

What I haven't heard about is the status of the
*other* double-deckers, the ones operated only by a driver. Are these
still in use on some routes or have they been totally replaced without
my hearing about it? If they are still in use, are they expected to
be totally replaced?

As others have already said, one-person double-deckers remain the
commonest type in London. Among routes that have switched from
single- to double-deckers in recent years are 28 and 31, both of which
were converted from Routemasters to small single-deckers (at a much
higher frequency) around 1990.

One effect of the insistence on low-floor buses, whcih have really
only been the norm for double-deckers for the last ten years or so, is
that currently London has quite a young fleet of buses. About the
oldest one-person double-deckers that you see are 'S' registration,
which would have been new in 1998-9, but most are much newer than
that.

And what about the smaller single-deck buses
that I used to see on some of the quieter routes?

You don't now see many of the very small buses that were once popular:
there are exceptions such as routes H2/3 around Hampstead Garden
Suburb, which serve roads which could not accommodate bigger
vehicles.



Martin

On May 19, 8:50 am, Martin Rich wrote:

You don't now see many of the very small buses that were once popular:
there are exceptions such as routes H2/3 around Hampstead Garden
Suburb, which serve roads which could not accommodate bigger
vehicles.

Theres lots of those still pottering around in north london. 326, 382
& W6 spring to mind.

B2003

On Mon, 19 May 2008 00:17:49 +0100, James Farrar
wrote:

On Sun, 18 May 2008 22:58:54 +0100, Paul Corfield
wrote:

Boris Johnson, the new
Mayor, wants to consign all of these to the scrap yard.

Is that actually true, or does he just want to stop using them on TfL
services?

It was a turn of phrase. What I understand is the "policy" position is
that bendy buses would be withdrawn from use on TfL services. What is
very unclear is how and when this will be done. The other aspect that
is unclear is whether the "new Routemaster" scheme is linked to the
bendy bus issue or not.

Only a few bendy routes are those previously run by RMs and thus we get
to an interesting issue about whether the new RM, if it is ever built,
would replace standard double decks on routes like the 13, 14, 19, 22,
390. Would they be deployed on routes like the 253 or 254 which are
very, very busy and were run with RMs years before but which could
justifiably be a stronger candidate for conversion back to crew than
some other routes? Would the new RM be put onto routes like the 18 or
29 which are bendy now but were OPO double deck for years before
conversion but which were frankly spending more time standing still at
stops than going anywhere.

None of this has been considered as far as I am aware - if it has then a
very tight lid is being kept on the details for probably understandable
reasons. You can imagine the campaigns to get the new RM on your local
service - bang goes the budget for the scheme.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

On Mon, 19 May 2008 00:22:29 +0100, "Tim Roll-Pickering"
wrote:

Paul Corfield wrote:

The most surprising (to me) aspect is how busy
Sunday services are - I've been out most Sundays recently and many buses
are full or near to full which is a big turn round from about 10 years
ago when demand was much lower.

Sometimes too full - how often are Sunday services reviewed and potentially
expanded?

The standard TfL answer is that routes are reviewed every 5 years about
18 months before they are retendered or considered for contract
extension (if performance has been good). This is certainly the answer
I have had from TfL when corresponding with them about my local
services.

When routes are retendered then some will get improved frequencies while
a 2 year "good performance" extension also triggers frequency
improvements and these are typically Evenings and Sundays.

Service enhancements can occur independently of that cycle and I would
guess that it is the result of surveys, operator or passenger feedback
or review of performance information. If routes are chronically
overloaded then their performance would fall. Oyster and ticket machine
data is another source of info too.

One particular problem I've seen is the over reliance on existing bus routes
to double as rail replacement services. The Central Line betwen Mile End and
Stratford is the most obvious case in my normal routine and often I've found
the 25 ridiculously crowded (even by its standards) and insufficiently
frequent when there's no tube between those points.

I agree that the current extent of weekend engineering works is leading
to diversion to bus services. The current Victoria Line closures at
weekends either stop me using the tube altogether or else I transfer to
the bus. I'm not a great enthusiast for the limited rail replacement
services that operate. You cite the 25 as an example but the 25 has
been awful for years no matter what day of the week. I remain amazed
that it is as busy as it is given that it is duplicated over its length
by other rail and bus routes. The Sunday 25 has recently been increased
in frequency in an attempt to cope - it had a temporary enhancement
between Aldgate and Stratford for a few months. Whether TfL will agree
to increase the main service on M-S using spare former route 453 buses
will be interesting - will Boris allow it!?

--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

has too much detail for you, but would show what are single-deck and
double-deck routes (and usually the length of the bus type), but
currently there are a number of routes in the list that say DD when they
should say SD.

I find to read that listing you do actually need to have some understanding
of bus chassis and body types to know what is single deck and what double
deck. In that listing SD means single door and DD dual door.

In article ,
(Paul Corfield) wrote:

Only a few bendy routes are those previously run by RMs and thus we get
to an interesting issue about whether the new RM, if it is ever built,
would replace standard double decks on routes like the 13, 14, 19, 22,
390. Would they be deployed on routes like the 253 or 254 which are
very, very busy and were run with RMs years before but which could
justifiably be a stronger candidate for conversion back to crew than
some other routes? Would the new RM be put onto routes like the 18 or
29 which are bendy now but were OPO double deck for years before
conversion but which were frankly spending more time standing still at
stops than going anywhere.

A lot of the later bendy-bus routes were Routemaster replacements, e.g.
12, 38, 73.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On Mon, 19 May 2008 01:35:33 -0700 (PDT), Boltar
wrote:

On May 19, 8:50 am, Martin Rich wrote:

You don't now see many of the very small buses that were once popular:
there are exceptions such as routes H2/3 around Hampstead Garden
Suburb, which serve roads which could not accommodate bigger
vehicles.

Theres lots of those still pottering around in north london. 326, 382
& W6 spring to mind.

They are all different sizes though and considerably bigger than the
Solos on the H2/3. The 326 vehicles are about 10m, the W6 just under
and the 382 are midi Darts at 8.8m.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!