When you have induhviduals like Boltar who simply don't want to listen,
or can't or just want to wind you up, then that is the reason why many
LU employees don't post onto this newgroup, if all that happens is you
get abuse why bother.



Malcolm & Nika wrote:
"Brimstone" wrote in message
...

"Mick" wrote in message
...

As I suspected, you don't.

Well come on then Brimstone - what's the explanation that we should all
understand???? I'm curious.


Who said anything about all? Obviously another arrogant prat who thinks
everything is addressed to him.



Its not my line, it does seem like a long time to me also. I will however
say all those things my mate Boltar doesn't like - until i find out
otherwise. I can't make a judgement until i get the facts - Boltar take
note!
I will try and find out what happened in the morning. No promises....

On Fri, 03 Jun 2005 12:42:37 GMT, General Von Clinkerhoffen
wrote:

In this situation, there was no immediate chance of anyone dying,
although dehydration is nasty passengers should be evacuated long before
that becomes a problem.

How can you be so certain?

In the event of a fire, flood etc I can assure you that as a driver I
will get Traction Current off, I will get the emergency ladder out, I
will do all I can to get everyone to safety, that is what I am paid to
do, that is what I will do.

Accepted. It is what you are paid to do in the case of a train
failure which we are attempting to discuss.

--
Peter Lawrence

Well generally people don't die from Dehydration within say 2 hours on
the hottest day of the year, that's not to say it can't happen but it is
unlikely, I would also like to add that if it is warm it is common sense
to carry a bottle of water with you.



Peter Lawrence wrote:
On Fri, 03 Jun 2005 12:42:37 GMT, General Von Clinkerhoffen
wrote:


In this situation, there was no immediate chance of anyone dying,
although dehydration is nasty passengers should be evacuated long before
that becomes a problem.


How can you be so certain?


In the event of a fire, flood etc I can assure you that as a driver I
will get Traction Current off, I will get the emergency ladder out, I
will do all I can to get everyone to safety, that is what I am paid to
do, that is what I will do.


Accepted. It is what you are paid to do in the case of a train
failure which we are attempting to discuss.

Brimstone wrote:


I'm sure anyone with a genuine interest in the Underground and how it does,
and doesn't, function is interested. However whinging and slagging off
people who do their best in difficult circumstances isn't going to encourage
those who do know to pass on their knowledge.


Your post may have gone astray, the earliest I have from you (and I
suspect other posters) is two lines directed at "Boltar". Perhaps you
could post your explicit explanation again, for my benefit at least.

Francis

Francis Davey wrote:
Brimstone wrote:


I'm sure anyone with a genuine interest in the Underground and how
it does, and doesn't, function is interested. However whinging and
slagging off people who do their best in difficult circumstances
isn't going to encourage those who do know to pass on their
knowledge.


Your post may have gone astray, the earliest I have from you (and I
suspect other posters) is two lines directed at "Boltar". Perhaps you
could post your explicit explanation again, for my benefit at least.


That was my first post. I too am hoping for word on what went wrong.
However, given that it was Boltar who started this thread in his usual
manner I'm not holding my breath.

On Sat, 4 Jun 2005 16:19:28 +0000 (UTC), "Brimstone"
wrote:

That was my first post. I too am hoping for word on what went wrong.
However, given that it was Boltar who started this thread in his usual
manner I'm not holding my breath.

I only have partial information and this is put here in good faith. I'm
not getting into a slanging match with *anyone* as to the rights and
wrongs as I would expect there to be a full investigation.

The points from the siding to the e/s platform failed at Marble Arch.
Trains were trapped to the west of the station. An attempt was made to
bring the track "back up" by taking a train in and out of the siding.
The passage of a train can often put the signals back into working
order.

The train movement made no difference. The points were then secured to
allow trains to run on the main line. There was a problem in doing this
properly and when the first train ran through the points were damaged.
When this happened it was evident that the two remaining trains stuck
between Lancaster Gate and Marble Arch would need to be evacuated which
was then done effectively. As per standard procedure medical staff and
an ambulance were in place to attend to the evacuated passengers.

Metronet undertook temporary repairs to get the line running again.
Permanent repairs were made in engineering hours.

I think it is safe to say that there were mistakes made and that lessons
will be learnt. I would expect there to be a full investigation and
report into the incident. Such reports and actions are tracked at Board
Level - I should know as I've had some in the past - and all progress on
the actions is monitored by the HMRI.

I hope that is helpful to group members - including those who think we
are all a bunch of useless @@!@£@&!s
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sat, 4 Jun 2005 16:19:28 +0000 (UTC), "Brimstone"
wrote:

That was my first post. I too am hoping for word on what went wrong.
However, given that it was Boltar who started this thread in his
usual manner I'm not holding my breath.

I only have partial information and this is put here in good faith.
I'm not getting into a slanging match with *anyone* as to the rights
and wrongs as I would expect there to be a full investigation.

The points from the siding to the e/s platform failed at Marble Arch.
Trains were trapped to the west of the station. An attempt was made to
bring the track "back up" by taking a train in and out of the siding.
The passage of a train can often put the signals back into working
order.

The train movement made no difference. The points were then secured to
allow trains to run on the main line. There was a problem in doing
this properly and when the first train ran through the points were
damaged. When this happened it was evident that the two remaining
trains stuck between Lancaster Gate and Marble Arch would need to be
evacuated which was then done effectively. As per standard procedure
medical staff and an ambulance were in place to attend to the
evacuated passengers.

Metronet undertook temporary repairs to get the line running again.
Permanent repairs were made in engineering hours.

I think it is safe to say that there were mistakes made and that
lessons will be learnt. I would expect there to be a full
investigation and report into the incident. Such reports and actions
are tracked at Board Level - I should know as I've had some in the
past - and all progress on the actions is monitored by the HMRI.

I hope that is helpful to group members - including those who think we
are all a bunch of useless @@!@£@&!s

Thanks Paul. Fortunately the latter are in the minority and are well known.

"General Von Clinkerhoffen" wrote in message
...
When you have induhviduals like Boltar who simply don't want to listen, or
can't or just want to wind you up, then that is the reason why many LU
employees don't post onto this newgroup, if all that happens is you get
abuse why bother.



In regard to what happened I have nothing to add to what Paul said.
Boltars opinion is based on facts he has seen.....thats how we all make
opinions. I respect his opinions, it shows what we have to do to improve our
'public' face. I'm happy to read what he has to say.
However, (theres always a but), Boltar is not aware of the other 20+
incidents that occured on the Central line that day that were dealt with
quickly with minmal delays.
You may be surprised to learn that on the Thursday evening, the Victoria
line suffered a points failure that left trains in tunnels but prompt action
from Managers, Train ops and station staff had all detrained, including
bringing trains up behind one another for people to walk through, within 30
minutes. Yes Boltar, thats passing a signal at danger..........which is
where we started i think??? Service was suspended for nearly 1 hour in
total.
No news story there then???

Mal

Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sat, 4 Jun 2005 16:19:28 +0000 (UTC), "Brimstone"
wrote:

That was my first post. I too am hoping for word on what went
wrong. However, given that it was Boltar who started this thread
in his usual manner I'm not holding my breath.

I only have partial information and this is put here in good faith.
I'm not getting into a slanging match with *anyone* as to the
rights and wrongs as I would expect there to be a full
investigation.

The points from the siding to the e/s platform failed at Marble
Arch. Trains were trapped to the west of the station. An attempt
was made to bring the track "back up" by taking a train in and out
of the siding. The passage of a train can often put the signals
back into working order.

The train movement made no difference. The points were then secured
to allow trains to run on the main line. There was a problem in
doing this properly and when the first train ran through the points
were damaged. When this happened it was evident that the two
remaining trains stuck between Lancaster Gate and Marble Arch would
need to be evacuated which was then done effectively. As per
standard procedure medical staff and an ambulance were in place to
attend to the evacuated passengers.

Metronet undertook temporary repairs to get the line running again.
Permanent repairs were made in engineering hours.

I think it is safe to say that there were mistakes made and that
lessons will be learnt. I would expect there to be a full
investigation and report into the incident. Such reports and
actions are tracked at Board Level - I should know as I've had some
in the past - and all progress on the actions is monitored by the
HMRI.

I hope that is helpful to group members - including those who think
we are all a bunch of useless @@!@£@&!s

Thanks for all this, Paul.

LU seem to have given up putting out any press releases about such
incidents, leaving us to depend on the Evening Standard. It used to be
the case that whenever there was a serious delay or a slow evacuation, a
press release was put out which gave some information to explain what
happened and why, and also to apologise and demonstrate concern for its
passengers. All good customer service practice. But nowadays, they
seem to want to bury the bad news unless it's really bad (derailment
etc.) Do stations on the line affected still get printed posters with a
message from Tim O'Toole or the line boss, which also used to happen in
earlier years?

--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

"Richard J." wrote:

leaving us to depend on the Evening Standard.

Haven't read the actual paper recently, but the ES web site has seriously cut
back their coverage of transportation issues. With the exception of a recent
story on how chuffed Ken Livingston was with his congestion charge scheme,
you'll be hard pressed to find anything on the ES web pages about the tube.