Leyton tube about 8pm Saturday night.

Hope there weren't too many pre-pay people going through...

For what it's worth, I have a season Oyster so didn't stop to question
it. Then, as it happened, I forgot I was going out of my zone without
pre-pay.

When I got to South Woodford, I couldn't get out of course, so rather
than even making me pay an extension, the 2 SAs kindly let me out for
free (perhaps cos we both talked the same Oyster jargon :-), and I
promised to go and put some pre-pay on to get back in later on.

However, if I HAD had Pre-pay on the Oyster, what would have happened
given that I had no entry recorded? Just an unresolved journey or a
charge of how much on the pre-pay?

In message , Dave Newt
writes

Leyton tube about 8pm Saturday night.

Hope there weren't too many pre-pay people going through...

Are you certain the readers were off? The gates can be set to open but
wouldn't normally be powered down unless there's a fault.

For what it's worth, I have a season Oyster so didn't stop to question
it. Then, as it happened, I forgot I was going out of my zone without
pre-pay.

When I got to South Woodford, I couldn't get out of course, so rather
than even making me pay an extension, the 2 SAs kindly let me out for
free (perhaps cos we both talked the same Oyster jargon :-), and I
promised to go and put some pre-pay on to get back in later on.

However, if I HAD had Pre-pay on the Oyster, what would have happened
given that I had no entry recorded? Just an unresolved journey or a
charge of how much on the pre-pay?

If you had no Pre Pay and went out of Zone you'd have a debit of £1.00
showing. On the way back you'd need to put £2.00 for the cost of two
extensions (assuming you have 1 - 2)

--
Kat Me, Ambivalent? Well, yes and no.

Kat wrote:

In message , Dave Newt
writes

Leyton tube about 8pm Saturday night.

Hope there weren't too many pre-pay people going through...

Are you certain the readers were off? The gates can be set to open but
wouldn't normally be powered down unless there's a fault.

Absolutely. No lights and no reaction. (I tried briefly.)

In fact, when I got out at South Woodford, I didn't understand why the
machine's "View Oyster Usage" option didn't show that I had just come
from Leyton. Later I remembered it was because the machines were off, so
the entire journey didn't exist.

For what it's worth, I have a season Oyster so didn't stop to question
it. Then, as it happened, I forgot I was going out of my zone without
pre-pay.

When I got to South Woodford, I couldn't get out of course, so rather
than even making me pay an extension, the 2 SAs kindly let me out for
free (perhaps cos we both talked the same Oyster jargon :-), and I
promised to go and put some pre-pay on to get back in later on.

However, if I HAD had Pre-pay on the Oyster, what would have happened
given that I had no entry recorded? Just an unresolved journey or a
charge of how much on the pre-pay?

If you had no Pre Pay and went out of Zone you'd have a debit of £1.00
showing.

So it would assume I had started in Z1-3 (my season)? So if a Z6-D gate
had been off, I would have only paid £1 to get out in Z4, since it would
have assumed I came in in Z1-3?

On the way back you'd need to put £2.00 for the cost of two
extensions (assuming you have 1 - 2)

Oh yeah, getting back would not be a problem - I mean the extension
calculator didn't know where I got on in this case, so I am just
wondering how it would guess where I got on (and what it would guess).

In message , Dave Newt
writes
Kat wrote:
Are you certain the readers were off? The gates can be set to open but
wouldn't normally be powered down unless there's a fault.

Absolutely. No lights and no reaction. (I tried briefly.)

OK, I can find out about that.


So it would assume I had started in Z1-3 (my season)? So if a Z6-D gate
had been off, I would have only paid £1 to get out in Z4, since it would
have assumed I came in in Z1-3?

On the way back you'd need to put £2.00 for the cost of two
extensions (assuming you have 1 - 2)

Oh yeah, getting back would not be a problem - I mean the extension
calculator didn't know where I got on in this case, so I am just
wondering how it would guess where I got on (and what it would guess).

I've given up assuming anything about what Oyster cards might guess. If
you go to a ticket office and get your journey resolved, you can tell
them where and why you couldn't validate the start of your journey and
they ought to accept your word for it.
I imagine you've used your Oyster since Saturday, so how much did you
have to pay?
--
Kat Me, Ambivalent? Well, yes and no.

Kat wrote:

In message , Dave Newt
writes
Kat wrote:
Are you certain the readers were off? The gates can be set to open but
wouldn't normally be powered down unless there's a fault.

Absolutely. No lights and no reaction. (I tried briefly.)

OK, I can find out about that.


So it would assume I had started in Z1-3 (my season)? So if a Z6-D gate
had been off, I would have only paid £1 to get out in Z4, since it would
have assumed I came in in Z1-3?

On the way back you'd need to put £2.00 for the cost of two
extensions (assuming you have 1 - 2)

Oh yeah, getting back would not be a problem - I mean the extension
calculator didn't know where I got on in this case, so I am just
wondering how it would guess where I got on (and what it would guess).

I've given up assuming anything about what Oyster cards might guess. If
you go to a ticket office and get your journey resolved, you can tell
them where and why you couldn't validate the start of your journey and
they ought to accept your word for it.
I imagine you've used your Oyster since Saturday, so how much did you
have to pay?

Hmm, nothing in this case - my journey was not unresolved, since the
machines were off on entry, and the SAs were nice on exit. :-)

(Plus I didn't reenter anyway, got a lift home.)

I think at South Woodford there is no cash office inside the gate, so
they had to let me out even if they were gonna make me buy an extension.
However, they made it clear they didn't expect me to, they just said
"we'd suggest you put some prepay on for coming back and if this journey
comes up as unresolved, go to the ticket office to sort it out".

In a way, I am glad there wasn't any prepay on it, since I don't know
how much it would have deducted!

In message , Dave Newt
writes
In a way, I am glad there wasn't any prepay on it, since I don't know
how much it would have deducted!

It wouldn't have mattered if there *was* or *was not* Pre Pay on it, if
the validators had been working you'd have been charged £1.00 anyway.
No Pre Pay at all and it's a debit (shows as -£1.00)
Any Pre Pay amount at all (say 20p) and it would show -£0.80 or
whatever.
Pre Pay is enabled on ALL Oyster cards... except ours it seems.
--
Kat Me, Ambivalent? Well, yes and no.

In message , Dave Newt
writes

Hmm, nothing in this case - my journey was not unresolved, since the
machines were off on entry, and the SAs were nice on exit. :-)

I thought you said you couldn't get out at South Woodford. Was this
because the Oyster wouldn't open the gate or because you didn't try
because you realised that not validating at Leyton would cause problems?
--
Kat Me, Ambivalent? Well, yes and no.

Kat wrote:

In message , Dave Newt
writes

Hmm, nothing in this case - my journey was not unresolved, since the
machines were off on entry, and the SAs were nice on exit. :-)

I thought you said you couldn't get out at South Woodford. Was this
because the Oyster wouldn't open the gate or because you didn't try
because you realised that not validating at Leyton would cause problems?

I tried and it didn't let me out.

However, I'm still struggling with understanding for which reason it
chose to do so!

i.e. because there was zero prepay (should have let me out with a
negative balance?) or because there was no recorded entry (should have
done - er no idea) or some other reason.

In message , Dave Newt
writes
Kat wrote:

In message , Dave Newt
writes

Hmm, nothing in this case - my journey was not unresolved, since the
machines were off on entry, and the SAs were nice on exit. :-)

I thought you said you couldn't get out at South Woodford. Was this
because the Oyster wouldn't open the gate or because you didn't try
because you realised that not validating at Leyton would cause problems?

I tried and it didn't let me out.

However, I'm still struggling with understanding for which reason it
chose to do so!

i.e. because there was zero prepay (should have let me out with a
negative balance?) or because there was no recorded entry (should have
done - er no idea) or some other reason.

Some other reason I suspect.
The gates should open with a warning Seek Assistance if you have either
a negative Pre Pay balance or an Unresolved Journey.
They just won't let you IN again until it's been sorted out.
--
Kat Me, Ambivalent? Well, yes and no.

On Tue, 20 Jan 2004 00:43:46 +0000, Dave Newt
wrote:

Kat wrote:

In message , Dave Newt
writes

Hmm, nothing in this case - my journey was not unresolved, since the
machines were off on entry, and the SAs were nice on exit. :-)

I thought you said you couldn't get out at South Woodford. Was this
because the Oyster wouldn't open the gate or because you didn't try
because you realised that not validating at Leyton would cause problems?

I tried and it didn't let me out.

However, I'm still struggling with understanding for which reason it
chose to do so!

i.e. because there was zero prepay (should have let me out with a
negative balance?) or because there was no recorded entry (should have
done - er no idea) or some other reason.

My guess is that the gates at South Woodford didn't let you out because
there was no recorded entry point given that you had travelled beyond
your zonal availability. The system needs to know where you entered to
calculate any pre-pay deduction as you could have entered at Zone 6 at
Epping or equally Zone 5 in West London.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!