On Sat, 12 Jul 2003 20:45:53 +0100, Matthew P Jones
wrote:

I have found it very difficult using the TFL web site to work out
exactly where bus routes go.

Well these sites are more for enthusiasts but they have loads of
information and timetables. I use them in preference to the TfL website
and its rather silly journey planner.

www.londonbusroutes.net for route details, changes etc
www.busmap.co.uk for a downloadable London wide bus map or you can buy
one.

I think I have worked out that I could use bus route 187 to go from near
Finchley Road station to near Queens Park station.

yep that bus links those 2 places. The other alternative would be a 31
from Swiss Cottage to Carlton Vale plus a short walk. This may be out of
your way but the 31 is very frequent although also very busy.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

In reply to news post, which Paul Corfield wrote
on Sun, 13 Jul 2003 -
On Sat, 12 Jul 2003 20:45:53 +0100, Matthew P Jones
wrote:

I have found it very difficult using the TFL web site to work out
exactly where bus routes go.

Well these sites are more for enthusiasts but they have loads of
information and timetables. I use them in preference to the TfL website
and its rather silly journey planner.

www.londonbusroutes.net for route details, changes etc
www.busmap.co.uk for a downloadable London wide bus map or you can buy
one.

I think I have worked out that I could use bus route 187 to go from near
Finchley Road station to near Queens Park station.

yep that bus links those 2 places. The other alternative would be a 31
from Swiss Cottage to Carlton Vale plus a short walk. This may be out of
your way but the 31 is very frequent although also very busy.

Thanks for all replies. Am coming in from Amersham, usually go into
Marylebone and out on the Bakerloo, but the closure of Bakerloo tube in
the mornings is going to cause delay, so am looking for alternatives.

The Met trains take longer, but would I save by not going into central
London?. I have used the North London Line from Finchley Rd & Frognal
(or West Hampstead) down to Brondesbury Park, but this service is every
15 minutes and if the connections are not right I can end up with quite
a wait. The South Hampstead option offers trains every 20 minutes,
again I could be in for a long wait. I was hoping busses would be more
frequent, I will have a look at the 31
--
Matthew P Jones - www.amersham.org.uk
My view of the Metropolitan Line www.metroland.org.uk - actually I like it
Don't reply to it will not be read
You can reply to knap AT Nildram dot co dot uk

Steve Naïve writes
Just had another thought - combine the 187 and the 31 to make a 328.

I would have thought that using the general principle of Busmaths; if
you combine a 187 & a 31, you should get a 218 and not a 328? Is this
an example of the Brondesbury Bus-Bunching Co-efficient?

I'll get me coat...

--
Dave

"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 12 Jul 2003 20:45:53 +0100, Matthew P Jones
wrote:

I have found it very difficult using the TFL web site to work out
exactly where bus routes go.

Well these sites are more for enthusiasts but they have loads of
information and timetables. I use them in preference to the TfL website
and its rather silly journey planner.

www.londonbusroutes.net for route details, changes etc
www.busmap.co.uk for a downloadable London wide bus map or you can buy
one.

What's silly about the TfL Journey Planner? It's certainly more useful than
a bus map or a set of route timetables for finding the quickest route from A
to B.
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

In reply to news post, which Paul Corfield wrote
on Mon, 14 Jul 2003 -
On Sun, 13 Jul 2003 15:29:03 GMT, "Richard J."
wrote:

What's silly about the TfL Journey Planner? It's certainly more useful than
a bus map or a set of route timetables for finding the quickest route from A
to B.

I find the whole thing impenetrable. It is user unfriendly - it took
over 10 attempts to identify the system's name for my local stop. Why
should I have to go to that sort of trouble? The same issue applies to
many stops across London where the road name or colloquial name for a
given location is not recognised by the planner even though the bus
timetable and bus blinds do show the name! The routes it plots are often
not very sensible IMO, of course. I don't think I'd make the effort to
use it if I was a motorist and contemplating using public transport
given how cumbersome it is to use.

The timetables are difficult to access and often wrong. I have raised
this with TfL btw. Other sources of easy to use information were also
removed from the TfL website when the Jny Planner was introduced and I
consider that to be a retrograde step as well considering the base
information is produced for other purposes - also raised with TfL.

I found it hard to use. I was looking for a route, but did not know the
area so had many many goes at trying to find what I wanted.

For buses they used to have route maps which I found very useful, the
"spider" maps are not very easy to understand.
--
Matthew P Jones - www.amersham.org.uk
My view of the Metropolitan Line www.metroland.org.uk - actually I like it
Don't reply to it will not be read
You can reply to knap AT Nildram dot co dot uk

On Mon, 14 Jul 2003 20:03:15 GMT, "Richard J."
wrote:

[stop names in TfL jny planner]
AFAIK the names used on the JP are the same as those displayed on the bus
stops. If you don't know the name for the stop, you can always enter the
road name as an address.

Well yes I worked out that I can put my address in. What it then does is
tell me to walk (up hill) to Walthamstow Central when I can quite easily
get a bus to another local tube station. I cannot force the system to
offer me the local bus option.

Also why I do need to learn the name of my local bus stop? If I was a
car driver with no knowledge of buses but had to make use of one I'd be
pretty unimpressed with a journey planner that expects me to know the
terminology that TfL employ rather than the name of the road the stop is
on.

The thinking behind a system that works in that sort of fashion is
somewhat customer unfriendly and must be designed and tested by people
who obviously don't use the transport system.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 14 Jul 2003 20:03:15 GMT, "Richard J."
wrote:

[stop names in TfL jny planner]
AFAIK the names used on the JP are the same as those displayed on the bus
stops. If you don't know the name for the stop, you can always enter the
road name as an address.

Well yes I worked out that I can put my address in. What it then does is
tell me to walk (up hill) to Walthamstow Central when I can quite easily
get a bus to another local tube station. I cannot force the system to
offer me the local bus option.

Also why I do need to learn the name of my local bus stop? If I was a
car driver with no knowledge of buses but had to make use of one I'd be
pretty unimpressed with a journey planner that expects me to know the
terminology that TfL employ rather than the name of the road the stop is
on.

But that was the point of my previous post. You *can* just enter the name
of the road the stop is on (as an address). It will probably ask you where
on the road you mean, e.g. junction with road X or road Y or whatever. You
can also force it to offer the bus option by unticking the boxes for
Underground and National Rail under More Options.
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

In message , Paul Corfield
writes
It is user unfriendly - it took over 10 attempts to identify the
system's name for my local stop. Why should I have to go to that sort
of trouble?

Why not just enter your postcode?
--
CJG

If you can get a 31 you can get off at Kilburn Park and it is one stop to
Queens Park (if you were wishing to go on from Queens Park you can either stay
on the Bakerloo or change to silverlink).

Incidentally, regarding comments on TfL, I have found their route planners
quite handy, eg, on New Year's Eve, they came up with routes I hadn't thought
of by combining stations and all night bus routes, having the times etc. More
recently when I started my journey plan from my own road, it came up with
intersections to specify, quite useful as I'm on a long road without buses, and
proximity to nearby bus routes depends whereabouts on my road you start.
Now if you were to ask my opinion on the tube site, which I've just tried for
information on freedom pass limits (couldn't even find "freedom pass" with a
search, and their "FAQs" page provided no answers), I'd say "silly" was a
euphemism.

On 17 Jul 2003 21:24:33 GMT, (CharlesPottins)
wrote:

If you can get a 31 you can get off at Kilburn Park and it is one stop to
Queens Park (if you were wishing to go on from Queens Park you can either stay
on the Bakerloo or change to silverlink).

Incidentally, regarding comments on TfL, I have found their route planners
quite handy, eg, on New Year's Eve, they came up with routes I hadn't thought
of by combining stations and all night bus routes, having the times etc. More
recently when I started my journey plan from my own road, it came up with
intersections to specify, quite useful as I'm on a long road without buses, and
proximity to nearby bus routes depends whereabouts on my road you start.
Now if you were to ask my opinion on the tube site, which I've just tried for
information on freedom pass limits (couldn't even find "freedom pass" with a
search, and their "FAQs" page provided no answers), I'd say "silly" was a
euphemism.
Correct me if this wrong, but isn't Freedom Pass managed by the
boroughs - TfL merely accept it?

www.freedompass.org?

Rob.
rob at robertwoolley dot co dot uk