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#1
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
In message , Mystery Flyer
writes Was platform 1 at Clapham Junction ever used? Yes, IIRC it was the original departure platform for services leaving via the West London line (originally just to Kensington, but later there were a number of others, such as the LSWR's roundabout route from Clapham Junction to Richmond via Kensington and Hammersmith). Trains would arrive at platform 2, detrain, and then pull into the carriage sidings to the west of the station, where the engine could run round the carriages and then pull back into platform 1 for departure. -- Paul Terry |
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
On Jun 27, 5:40 am, Paul Terry wrote:
Yes, IIRC it was the original departure platform for services leaving via the West London line (originally just to Kensington, but later there were a number of others, such as the LSWR's roundabout route from Clapham Junction to Richmond via Kensington and Hammersmith). Trains would arrive at platform 2, detrain, and then pull into the carriage sidings to the west of the station, where the engine could run round the carriages and then pull back into platform 1 for departure. Is this platform planned to be brought into use by TfL as part of any new Overground services to Clapham Junction? |
#3
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
In message .com,
TheOneKEA writes Is this platform planned to be brought into use by TfL as part of any new Overground services to Clapham Junction? I think it will when the East London Line Extension reaches Clapham Junction. The likely scenario seems to be that London Overground services running anticlockwise (i.e. on the ELLE) will use platform 2, while those running clockwise (i.e. on the West London Line) will move across to platform 1, thus offering cross-platform interchange. -- Paul Terry |
#4
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
"Paul Terry" wrote in message ... In message .com, TheOneKEA writes Is this platform planned to be brought into use by TfL as part of any new Overground services to Clapham Junction? I think it will when the East London Line Extension reaches Clapham Junction. The likely scenario seems to be that London Overground services running anticlockwise (i.e. on the ELLE) will use platform 2, while those running clockwise (i.e. on the West London Line) will move across to platform 1, thus offering cross-platform interchange. That fits in with everything I've read. Its considered impossible to run a reliable orbital service due to pathing and signalling constraints - a bit like the circle line really... Its interesting that the various proposals suggest that the trains running on the existing West London Line will be considered part of the North London Line, and those on the existing South London Line part of the East London Line; I wondered at first if the TfL planners were a bit geographically challenged, but it works if you consider getting on at CJ, platform 1 for trains round to North London, and platform 2 for trains round to the East. I think one issue if they manage to beef up the frequencies will be the fact that other WLL services will still be using platforms 16 and 17, its a pity all the services can't go from one part of the station, or can they? Paul |
#5
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
On Sat, 30 Jun 2007 14:25:59 +0100, "Paul Scott"
wrote: "Paul Terry" wrote in message ... In message .com, TheOneKEA writes Is this platform planned to be brought into use by TfL as part of any new Overground services to Clapham Junction? I think it will when the East London Line Extension reaches Clapham Junction. The likely scenario seems to be that London Overground services running anticlockwise (i.e. on the ELLE) will use platform 2, while those running clockwise (i.e. on the West London Line) will move across to platform 1, thus offering cross-platform interchange. Are you saying that trains will not actually run in a circle but would effectively reverse in the appropriate platform? Passengers would be forced to change in order to complete a cross Clapham Junction journey? That fits in with everything I've read. Its considered impossible to run a reliable orbital service due to pathing and signalling constraints - a bit like the circle line really... I think the S Bahn operators in Berlin might disagree with you. They seem to run a circular Ring Bahn perfectly well and also schedule overlap services over parts of the entire circuit to bolster frequencies and provide links onto radial S Bahn lines. I've used it and it seems pretty reliable to me and also well patronised. Circular services are only a problem when you try to run them with inadequate infrastructure or schedules that are too tight - are that would be why can't run them in this country then! -- Paul C Admits to working for London Underground! |
#6
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
"Paul Corfield" wrote in message ... On Sat, 30 Jun 2007 14:25:59 +0100, "Paul Scott" wrote: Are you saying that trains will not actually run in a circle but would effectively reverse in the appropriate platform? Passengers would be forced to change in order to complete a cross Clapham Junction journey? That fits in with everything I've read. Its considered impossible to run a reliable orbital service due to pathing and signalling constraints - a bit like the circle line really... I think the S Bahn operators in Berlin might disagree with you. They seem to run a circular Ring Bahn perfectly well and also schedule overlap services over parts of the entire circuit to bolster frequencies and provide links onto radial S Bahn lines. I've used it and it seems pretty reliable to me and also well patronised. Circular services are only a problem when you try to run them with inadequate infrastructure or schedules that are too tight - are that would be why can't run them in this country then! I believe thats the background to the T-cup proposals for the circle line and H&C isn't it? Paul S |
#7
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
On Sat, 30 Jun 2007 15:24:18 +0100, "Paul Scott"
wrote: "Paul Corfield" wrote in message .. . Circular services are only a problem when you try to run them with inadequate infrastructure or schedules that are too tight - are that would be why can't run them in this country then! I believe thats the background to the T-cup proposals for the circle line and H&C isn't it? It may be but my point is that circular services can run properly if you get non conflicting junctions and adequate signalling capacity. This is what Berlin has got on its S Bahn and the service runs fine. The LU proposals are an attempt to create reliability without the huge construction costs of removing conflicting junctions of which there are many on the Circle / District line. -- Paul C Admits to working for London Underground! |
#8
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
In message , Paul Corfield
writes "Paul Terry" wrote in message ... Are you saying that trains will not actually run in a circle but would effectively reverse in the appropriate platform? Passengers would be forced to change in order to complete a cross Clapham Junction journey? Yes, that's my understanding. On the map accessible from ... http://www.bbc.co.uk/london/content/..._feature.shtml Clapham Junction is shown as an interchange between the clockwise and anticlockwise routes, rather than as a through station. I guess it would be possible for trains to reverse at Clapham Junction and continue round the circle, but I imagine that it could produce all sorts of operating problems. -- Paul Terry |
#9
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
On Jun 30, 5:54 pm, Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Paul Corfield writes "Paul Terry" wrote in message ... Are you saying that trains will not actually run in a circle but would effectively reverse in the appropriate platform? Passengers would be forced to change in order to complete a cross Clapham Junction journey? Yes, that's my understanding. On the map accessible from ... http://www.bbc.co.uk/london/content/.../overground_tr... Clapham Junction is shown as an interchange between the clockwise and anticlockwise routes, rather than as a through station. I guess it would be possible for trains to reverse at Clapham Junction and continue round the circle, but I imagine that it could produce all sorts of operating problems. -- Paul Terry It would mean that trains arriving and departing would sometimes have to cross, but that happens at many two-platform termini with genuine metro frequencies (eg Elephant and Castle, Brixton). A dedicated platform for each direction would be a nice luxury, but would it be necessary with the frequencies planned? |
#10
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Claphan Junction Disused platform 1
Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Paul Corfield writes "Paul Terry" wrote in message ... Are you saying that trains will not actually run in a circle but would effectively reverse in the appropriate platform? Passengers would be forced to change in order to complete a cross Clapham Junction journey? Yes, that's my understanding. On the map accessible from ... http://www.bbc.co.uk/london/content/..._feature.shtml Clapham Junction is shown as an interchange between the clockwise and anticlockwise routes, rather than as a through station. I guess it would be possible for trains to reverse at Clapham Junction and continue round the circle, but I imagine that it could produce all sorts of operating problems. I can't think of any, unless you mean "reverse *promptly* at Clapham Junction and continue round the circle". It should produce a more robust service if the trains *do* continue around the circle, after a suitable wait... that way problems which affect the clockwise can't affect the anti and vice versa. |
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