Nick Catford seems to have added a shed load more photos of broad street
as was. Quite interesting not just for the railway itself but because you
can see the slow change in the City as the towers go up during the 70s.

If Broad street was still open today would it be a useful way of relieving
passenger and train congestion on other lines and termini? I assume when it
was demonlished it wasn't serving much useful purpose but then back then
the city had less people working in it. Would they be able to get away with
demolishing it today?


B2003

On Tue, 31 Mar 2009 11:48:08 +0000 (UTC)
wrote:


Nick Catford seems to have added a shed load more photos of broad street
as was. Quite interesting not just for the railway itself but because you
can see the slow change in the City as the towers go up during the 70s.


Duh, forgot to add the link.

http://www.subbrit.org.uk/sb-sites/s...et/index.shtml

B2003

wrote:
Nick Catford seems to have added a shed load more photos of broad
street as was. Quite interesting not just for the railway itself but
because you can see the slow change in the City as the towers go up
during the 70s.

If Broad street was still open today would it be a useful way of
relieving passenger and train congestion on other lines and termini?
I assume when it was demonlished it wasn't serving much useful
purpose but then back then the city had less people working in it.
Would they be able to get away with demolishing it today?


It would have been an interesting problem for the current ELL rebuilding
project at the very least, if the Kingsland viaduct route had still been
operational under Silverlink Metro, and let's assume it had four trains per
hour on its 2 tracks. So Stratford would probably have had less NLL services
due to the overall capacity Camden - Dalston Junction.

How might the LO & ELL changes have panned out then. Would the ELLX project
still have connected into the Kingsland viaduct and run round to Highbury,
after all it's four tracks wide, or just run up to terminate and interchange
at Dalston.

Or would ELL be as built, but with Broad St as another branch terminus, so
less trains cross the river...

Paul S

On Mar 31, 1:07*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
How might the LO & ELL changes have panned out then. Would the ELLX project
still have connected into the Kingsland viaduct and run round to Highbury,
after all it's four tracks wide, or just run up to terminate and interchange
at Dalston.

I'm not even sure there would have been an ELLX project in this case.

--
Abi

On Mar 31, 1:55*pm, Abigail Brady wrote:

On Mar 31, 1:07*pm, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

How might the LO & ELL changes have panned out then. Would the ELLX project
still have connected into the Kingsland viaduct and run round to Highbury,
after all it's four tracks wide, or just run up to terminate and interchange
at Dalston.

I'm not even sure there would have been an ELLX project in this case.


My thinking exactly. My reading of the inception of the ELLX scheme
was that that an opportunity was seen to connect an underutilised line
- the ELL - up with the disused trackbed between Broad Street and
Dalston Junction (and beyond), as well as reconnect it with the
mainline at the southern end (i.e. New Cross Gate), along with (re)
connecting it to the South London Line (i.e. phase 2 to Clapham Jn).

Thankfully that opportunity - which could so easily have become
another fantasy project such as those which have been discussed on
here many times before - was grasped and is being realised. I must say
I'm somewhat amazed this actually happened!

On 31 Mar, 13:55, Abigail Brady wrote:
I'm not even sure there would have been an ELLX project in this case.

The previous extension proposal to Cambridge Heath might have happened
instead.

(which would also allow the route across Bishopsgate Goods Yard to be
used to divert some Liverpool Street trains to Broad Street)

U

wrote in message ...
Nick Catford seems to have added a shed load more photos of broad street
as was. Quite interesting not just for the railway itself but because you
can see the slow change in the City as the towers go up during the 70s.

If Broad street was still open today would it be a useful way of relieving
passenger and train congestion on other lines and termini? I assume when
it
was demonlished it wasn't serving much useful purpose but then back then
the city had less people working in it. Would they be able to get away
with
demolishing it today?


Broad Street was a useless station because the only lines that could run to
it were Richmond and Watford. It took up far too much space for the small
number of people that arrived there.

When they demolished it, they routed the Richmond trains to Stratford (and
later to N Woolwich) to create the "modern NLL and built the Graham Road
curve (into LST) for the rush hour only Watford services. After a few years
they gave up with the latter.

Before the Richmond services were diverted to Stratford, there was no
service on this part of the line

So yes, they could close it now!

tim

"tim....." wrote in message
...

wrote in message ...
Nick Catford seems to have added a shed load more photos of broad street
as was. Quite interesting not just for the railway itself but because you
can see the slow change in the City as the towers go up during the 70s.

If Broad street was still open today would it be a useful way of
relieving
passenger and train congestion on other lines and termini? I assume when
it
was demonlished it wasn't serving much useful purpose but then back then
the city had less people working in it. Would they be able to get away
with
demolishing it today?


Broad Street was a useless station because the only lines that could run
to it were Richmond and Watford. It took up far too much space for the
small number of people that arrived there.

When they demolished it, they routed the Richmond trains to Stratford (and
later to N Woolwich) to create the "modern NLL and built the Graham Road
curve (into LST) for the rush hour only Watford services. After a few
years they gave up with the latter.

Before the Richmond services were diverted to Stratford, there was no
service on this part of the line

So yes, they could close it now!

tim

And what about the trains that used to come from the Great Northern lines.
As for the distasterous service into Liverpool St. Was it downgraded to just
one train in the morning and one in the evening. Hardly surprising no sane
person used it and hey presto there was the justification to stop running
it. Just like post Beeching.

Kevin

"zen83237" wrote in message
...

"tim....." wrote in message
...

wrote in message ...
Nick Catford seems to have added a shed load more photos of broad street
as was. Quite interesting not just for the railway itself but because
you
can see the slow change in the City as the towers go up during the 70s.

If Broad street was still open today would it be a useful way of
relieving
passenger and train congestion on other lines and termini? I assume when
it
was demonlished it wasn't serving much useful purpose but then back then
the city had less people working in it. Would they be able to get away
with
demolishing it today?


Broad Street was a useless station because the only lines that could run
to it were Richmond and Watford. It took up far too much space for the
small number of people that arrived there.

When they demolished it, they routed the Richmond trains to Stratford
(and later to N Woolwich) to create the "modern NLL and built the Graham
Road curve (into LST) for the rush hour only Watford services. After a
few years they gave up with the latter.

Before the Richmond services were diverted to Stratford, there was no
service on this part of the line

So yes, they could close it now!

tim

And what about the trains that used to come from the Great Northern lines.

These were removed before my time. My Baker from the period just before BS
was closed, shows this route as not possible at that time.

I have also discovered from a 1940 map, that the stations: Dalston to
Stratford had a service into BS via a Dalston East curve. This (service)
had gone by 1953, not sure when the curve was lifted.

As for the distasterous service into Liverpool St. Was it downgraded to
just one train in the morning and one in the evening.

6 trains a day, rush hours only, but IIRC it wasn't any different to the BS
service provided at closure, it just took 15 minutes longer and people
stopped using it because changing onto the Met at Wembley Park was quicker.

I also think that the change in the nature of city jobs from strict 9 to 5
must have had an effect on usage!

tim

tim..... wrote:
"zen83237" wrote in message
...

And what about the trains that used to come from the Great Northern
lines.

These were removed before my time. My Baker from the period just
before BS was closed, shows this route as not possible at that time.

Really? It would still be possible today. Head up the GN, turn left at
Finsbury Park, up Canonbury curve, then east down the North London line and
branch off at Dalston up to Broad Street.

That's why they were proposing Finsbury Park as a terminus for some ELLX
services at one time.