On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 17:36:09 +0100, "Paul Scott"
wrote:


"Mr Thant" wrote in message
.uk...
Peter Lawrence wrote:
Do I deduce from this post and Uriah's that there will be walking
routes both at platform/Champagne bar level and at undercroft/street
level? Having to use the higher level would be a pain for TL
passengers.


There is a route from the MML platform level all the way down to the front
of the station, on the west side, and then round towards the SE corner of
the train shed, where there is a level exit to the front of the station,
where I believe the cab entrance used to be. How else would they entice
people into the various pubs and restaurants, not to mention the champagne
bar? Exit here then leads either westwards down the old vehicle ramp towards
Euston Rd, or directly down a flight of steps to pavement level, immediately
to the south of the LU western ticket hall entrance onto Pancras Rd opposite
Kings Cross. Within the LU western ticket hall itself, there is (currently
boarded off) street level access to the St Pancras undercroft, immediately
next to the Eurostar ticket office, which is on the same level as the
combined ticket hall for the 3 domestic operators, although obviously some
distance away.

Thankyou.

I suspect the Thameslink escalators are where they are firstly to allow easy
change between MML and Thameslink (FCC) services,
For which the demand mist be ,minimal since they noth servce the same
line!
and secondly, so that they
are about half way along the 12 car platforms, which aids loading the 24 tph
trains more evenly.

But maximises the length of the queue trying to get out.

Also, those critical of the distances between the
domestic and LU SSL platforms may find that they have been designed that way
to break up what could otherwise be large numbers arriving simultaneously
off 9 car long distance or12 car Thameslink services. Perhaps an expert on
queuing theory could comment?

More likely the design reflects the location of straight track where
the TL station could be built!
--
Peter Lawrence

"Peter Lawrence" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 17:36:09 +0100, "Paul Scott"

I suspect the Thameslink escalators are where they are firstly to allow
easy
change between MML and Thameslink (FCC) services,

For which the demand mist be ,minimal since they noth servce the same
line!

I did think about that before suggesting it, as that seems to be the case
for southbound journies to London, but as Thameslink capacity gradually
increases, won't they expect more transfers from/to South of London
destinations into/from the longer distance MML services?

Paul

In message , at 14:06:27 on
Sun, 29 Jul 2007, Peter Lawrence remarked:
I suspect the Thameslink escalators are where they are firstly to allow easy
change between MML and Thameslink (FCC) services,
For which the demand mist be ,minimal since they noth servce the same
line!

But very few of the same stations to the north (just one of the two
Lutons, and Bedford, for every other MML train); and none of the
stations to the south (like Farringdon, City etc).
--
Roland Perry

On Sun, 29 Jul 2007 16:06:15 +0100, "Paul Scott"
wrote:


"Peter Lawrence" wrote in message
...
On Fri, 27 Jul 2007 17:36:09 +0100, "Paul Scott"

I suspect the Thameslink escalators are where they are firstly to allow
easy
change between MML and Thameslink (FCC) services,

For which the demand mist be ,minimal since they noth servce the same
line!

I did think about that before suggesting it, as that seems to be the case
for southbound journies to London, but as Thameslink capacity gradually
increases, won't they expect more transfers from/to South of London
destinations into/from the longer distance MML services?

If you are travelling to a destination north of Bedford, currently it
is easier to change at Luton Airport Parkway, Luton or Bedford in most
cases, rather than trudge through the passageways and hike to the MML
platforms at St Pancras.

With the new station open, changing at St Pancras becomes easier,
although still not as easy as a same-platform change at LAP.
--
Terry Harper
Website Coordinator, The Omnibus Society
http://www.omnibussoc.org

Will the Eurostar connection from St. Pancras employ only overhead wire as
well as the French signalling system for high-speed trains, the start of
which you currently find around Ashford International?

wrote in message
k...
Will the Eurostar connection from St. Pancras employ only overhead wire as
well as the French signalling system for high-speed trains, the start of
which you currently find around Ashford International?

Yes, it does. Currently, both TVM signalling and OCS start just east of
Fawkham Junction, somewhat to the north of Ashford.
Brian

"BH Williams" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
k...
Will the Eurostar connection from St. Pancras employ only overhead wire
as well as the French signalling system for high-speed trains, the start
of which you currently find around Ashford International?

Yes, it does. Currently, both TVM signalling and OCS start just east of
Fawkham Junction, somewhat to the north of Ashford.
Brian

Also - doesn't the TVM & OCS start at the London Tunnel portal at Kings
Cross, so that theoretically any UK train can use St Pancras station throat
and any platform? IIRC the last few km of signalling is more traditional at
the Paris end too?

Paul

"Paul Scott" wrote in message
...

"BH Williams" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
k...
Will the Eurostar connection from St. Pancras employ only overhead wire
as well as the French signalling system for high-speed trains, the start
of which you currently find around Ashford International?

Yes, it does. Currently, both TVM signalling and OCS start just east of
Fawkham Junction, somewhat to the north of Ashford.
Brian

Also - doesn't the TVM & OCS start at the London Tunnel portal at Kings
Cross, so that theoretically any UK train can use St Pancras station
throat and any platform? IIRC the last few km of signalling is more
traditional at the Paris end too?

Paul

Access to the northern end of HS1 is fairly limited, that to and from the
WCML being by the NLL, which presents pathing problems, from the MML being
by a single route from the Down Slow, and that from the ECML also being
single track. All these routes are provided with OCS.
I believe (though I'll have to check) that the station throat does have
lineside signals, TVM-based systems not being very efficient at low speeds.
At the Paris end, the various E*, TGV and Thalys share the conventional
tracks and signalling to a junction just north of Villiers-La Bel-Gonesse-
similar arrangements exist at Gare du Lyon, Montparnasse, Lyon Part Dieu and
Marseille St Charles.
Brian

"BH Williams" wrote in message
...

"Paul Scott" wrote in message
...

"BH Williams" wrote in message
...

wrote in message
k...
Will the Eurostar connection from St. Pancras employ only overhead wire
as well as the French signalling system for high-speed trains, the
start of which you currently find around Ashford International?

Yes, it does. Currently, both TVM signalling and OCS start just east of
Fawkham Junction, somewhat to the north of Ashford.
Brian

Also - doesn't the TVM & OCS start at the London Tunnel portal at Kings
Cross, so that theoretically any UK train can use St Pancras station
throat and any platform? IIRC the last few km of signalling is more
traditional at the Paris end too?

Paul

Access to the northern end of HS1 is fairly limited, that to and from the
WCML being by the NLL, which presents pathing problems, from the MML being
by a single route from the Down Slow, and that from the ECML also being
single track. All these routes are provided with OCS.

I wasn't really thinking about routine use, but say MML needing temporary
use of a Eurostar platform (notwithstanding access for passengers of
course).

Which reminds me, in the more general sense, what plans might there be for
MML capacity improvement in the medium term. An architecturally completely
different extra pair of platforms above Midland Rd perhaps? IIRC previous
discussions have shown that the 4 platformterminus reflects quite an
outdated version of passenger usage on the MML...

In message , at 11:12:46 on Mon,
30 Jul 2007, BH Williams remarked:
Access to the northern end of HS1 is fairly limited, that to and from the
WCML being by the NLL, which presents pathing problems, from the MML being
by a single route from the Down Slow, and that from the ECML also being
single track.

Isn't the line to/from the NLL also a single track to/from the
westbound[1] NLL, so an eastbound movement would cause even more
problems.

[1] shared most of the way with the route from NLL to ECML
--
Roland Perry